How to Make Passive Income with Airbnb WITHOUT OWNING PROPERTY ft. Shiv Gettu

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This is the Digital Nomad Quest podcast with Sharon Tseung. teaching people how to build passive income, become financially free and design the best lives.

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Hey guys, it’s Sharon from digital nomad quests. And today we have Shiv Gettu, we’re going to talk about the furnished rental business. So it’s basically another path with real estate investment that I feel like requires less capital and allows you to cash flow quicker. So I’m very curious about it. And I wanted to learn more. So thanks for being here today. And maybe can you tell us about yourself to the viewers out there? My name is Chef get to and I run a corporate furnished rentals business where we do actually corporate rentals and vacation rentals. We started about six months ago, and I still work a full time job but we have currently 12 properties under management right now. Awesome. So you do this with a partner right now? Right? Yeah, I do this with a partner. I’m a huge believer in having partners. I think obviously

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More people is more productive. But I think there’s also the element of like emotional, right when you’re going and starting a company. When you’ve never done anything like this before, there’s a lot of value in having someone where you can bounce off ideas with, you know, fail together, succeed together. And yeah, so I definitely recommend having a partnership to start a business. Cool. So we met like last year and last year yeah, we met like, right when I first thought about real estate I guess I was like, last July we met at that meetup. That was the first meetup I ever one. Yeah, I just remember talking to you. I told you this before but I was like, Oh my god, Sharon, like travel the world. She quit her job, like, built this passive income stream that just gave her the possibility to do all this. I was like, so amazed and yeah, yeah, but it’s so crazy that you’ve like basically accomplished so much in such a short time. It’s only been like few months, right? Basically. Yeah. Less than a year. Less than a year. Yeah. Yeah. It’s amazing. So maybe

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can tell us more about like the furnished rental business so maybe people out there probably don’t know like what that entails. So maybe you can say like the brief gist of it and the beginnings Sure. So furnished rentals. There’s a few ways you can look at it right but the idea is you have an apartment or home and the current way that people do real estate in terms of rentals is you rent out and unfurnished apartment or home for maybe a year long lease or more right and you’re getting typically market rent. The furnished rental arbitrage business is when you are either renting a property out for market rate unfurnished and you pivot the acid base from being an unfurnished long term rental to a furnished short term or mid term rental. The idea being if you’re paying x in market rent for a long term unfinished lease, you should expect anywhere you know greater than x. Obviously the multiple depends on the market, but you should expect more

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More than x and that’s your margin. That’s your profit, cash flow kind of. So do you like rent places for a year or something like that and then rent it out on Airbnb. Yeah, exactly. That’s the way to think about it. So we have a few different marketing channels that we leverage, you know, Airbnb, there’s the IBO bookings com Expedia, home away all these all this fun stuff, but that is idea so you there’s a few ways to do it. So I think rental arbitrage that word and furnished rental arbitrage means when you do the master lease, you sign the master lease and then you basically are guaranteeing the owner rent and you’re hoping to make a margin on top of that. The other way is when you take a management fee in the first way, the owner is just getting market rent but he’s getting guaranteed rent. The second way is you’re allowing the owner or the landlord to capitalize on the opportunity of vacation corporate rentals. So let’s say if your rent was $3,000 market rent, you could hope for maybe some multiple of that. And after you take your management fee, the goal would be to provide the landlord

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With more than $3,000 and you make money he makes money everyone’s happy. That’s awesome. Maybe you can walk us through like the first experience you had with this the furniture rental. So like maybe your first project Yeah. And slowly so much because it’s a really funny story.

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So yeah, so I, you know, we started basically, I started reaching out to everyone I knew, right, like everyone talks about the power of network, your network equals your net, your net worth equals your network all whatever way you supposed to say it, but I started reaching out to whoever I knew. And I came across one of my dad’s friends who was really into real estate has multiple properties all across the bay area, and I started trying to build a relationship with him and pitching this idea about furnished rentals and I like to take one of your units and sign a master lease and guarantee you rent and he was like, Okay, well, you know, you can try it and see how it goes. So I was like, Okay, cool. Like I had no idea what properties he own, like, whether it’s Class A Class B, you know, in the slums and you know, some words

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properties. So it turns out that like, his properties are a little bit not as nice. Okay? I mean they’re they’re more like, you know if you know people who know real estate there’s like a plus properties or a Class A properties, which is like new construction really nice. Then there’s like D properties which is, you know, very rundown bad neighborhood. His is like a b minus. But where were they in Redwood City? Oh, yeah. So the idea was like, Okay, well, let’s go to the building, sign a lease, and let’s get the furniture in and get started. Right. So this is my first unit. I was like, Okay, I’m really excited, like, went to the apartment, you know, wasn’t that impressed with the way it looked? And I was like, okay, whatever, like, let’s still do this. And I talked to the property manager, and we got a lease out and we signed the lease and everything like that. And I was like, Okay, well, you know, maybe I should just get the experience of like, staying in the apartment for a night and seeing how it was. And I guess I didn’t plan it because I didn’t have any blankets or pillows or anything. So I just ended up sleeping on the ground, but guess

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that’s besides the point. So I stayed in the apartment and then I started noticing I was like, wait, there’s quite a few bugs here. And I started noticing like they’re cockroaches in the bathroom, I open the cabinets. They’re like, bugs all around. I’m like, there’s no way we can take this and put it on hospitality websites and brand ourselves as a hospitality company. And it was a disaster. I was like, I was so excited. And then I stayed in that apartment. I was like, Oh my God, this, our whole idea has has can’t go anywhere. Right. And obviously, that was overblown, but that was my first experience. Okay, so the cash flow like it. So we didn’t end up doing the I told the property manager I was like, you know, they’re bugs in this unit. There’s no way we can go through with this and we never ended up signing signing the lease because I was like there’s no way this could work. I didn’t want to provide a product that had bugs to you know, it’s not Yeah, not quite ideal. So when do you like get Yeah, succeed? So my actual first unit I think was like a month after

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That so we rented a place in Pleasanton. It was in an apartment complex, a one bedroom, one bath. I think the numbers were We were paying around 2195 for rent. How did you find it? So we found it through this guy as well. Okay, so he owns something there. So I continued building that relationship with him and found it through that and rented it out. And we were like, Okay, well, like now we have an apartment. And we have no idea what to put in it. Because I’m not into I did engineering. My partner Kendrick did engineering. So we’re not particularly the design heavy people. Yeah, like for, you know, anterior design and all that artsy stuff. We were like, Okay, well, how can we What do we do now? And at the same time, Kendrick got connected with someone called al Williamson, who, you know, some of you may know he kind of pioneered in the small, bigger pockets, side community pioneer, this whole corporate rental finished rental business, he got connected with him and we got connected to this community of people who are doing similar things. And that was a huge help in the early days, right? Because you have all

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These questions like what furniture do I put in? Where do I buy it? Do I assemble it? You know, all the all these things? So we started asking people tons of questions and basically ended up using like Amazon some of it, we’re like, okay, we need to save money. So we like went on Craigslist and bought, like, used couches. And we realized that wasn’t the way to scale because it’s so manual and you’re picking up things and all that so ended up somehow putting together a decent, we furnished apartment and we still have it and it’s doing pretty well I think we were in that area might not be the best. And that’s where like an actual real estate location really matters. But even in this business, like location really matters. To talk a bit about the numbers. Sure, sure. It really varies all across, right. So in the present in property, we I would say annualized monthly cash flow, we’re probably at maybe 600 a month. You know, obviously in this industry, it’s very seasonal, right? So winters are typically slower. Summers are typically much more busy and that I would say that

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That could be average for that area. But there’s some areas where, for example, in Redwood City, we’re almost doubling market rent. So we’re paying X amount we’re getting to x. Wow. And that’s in the summer. But again, it’s it just really depends on the in the market. Yeah. How many properties you guys have now? We have 12. Yeah. So do you find it pretty passive? Or do you find it still like a decent amount of work? No, it’s it. So right now, it’s very passive, right? Like, the only thing that’s active is us working on the business. So the two outlooks, right so there’s working in the business versus working on the business working in the business means you’re involved in the operations, right? If you weren’t part of the business, then it wouldn’t be able to run that means you’re required to work in it for it to sustain itself. Yeah. When you’re talking about working on the business, it’s okay, you’ve built this engine that can grow on its own. But when you’re working on it, you’re like, how can I make this engine bigger and more powerful? Yeah. So now we’ve segue ourselves from working in the

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business so no longer really doing much of the operational work. I mean, quantitatively, we’re probably spending like two hours a week on the operations of the business. And most of our time is now like how can we expand grow scale markets to hit etc. So when you say markets, are you thinking of expanding past Barry or staying within their? Yeah, no, that’s a really good question. We actually just met with an investor earlier this morning and we’re looking to definitely get out of the bay area so we’re trying to be pretty ambitious with this we actually are negotiating right now a deal in Reno. So we’re going to take five units in the building and, and hopefully, depending on how the relationship goes that they eventually may want to give us the entire building which is 50 units. We’re also looking at other markets in Texas and yeah, definitely expanding and definitely continuing it till it become something that we don’t want to do or we’re think we’re at a stable rate. Wow, that’s, that’s Yeah, maybe we can talk about like the the initial capital needed. So for like for a complete beginner, right. So

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You basically have to pay what the year lease and like, like monthly and then the furniture and stuff like that like what what kind of costs? Are there? Sure, yeah. So there’s a few different costs depending on the model, right. So if your master leasing, which means you’re signing a lease with the landlord, you’re guaranteeing them rent and you’re responsible for funding all the furniture costs, then there’s more of an upfront costs, right. So the split between our units, we have 12 units totally, and 10 of them are master leasing, which means we bought all the furniture. Two of them are property management, which means we negotiate with the landlord for them to buy the furniture, we just take a management fee. So we’re essentially zero capital investing and making money from day one, basically, off manager fee. So for master leasing, it really depends on the quality of furniture you want. We typically spend around five to $7,000 to furnish a two bedroom then there’s the security deposit, which is dependent on the property and what else is there there’s labor right now. So initially, we were doing everything ourselves like drinking tons of Red Bull staying up

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Night like assembling all these IKEA beds, and we realized like, that’s not the way to scale. So now we have employees that are helping us with building and assembling all the units. But if you’re looking to do a completely like DIY solution, if you were to take a property in the Bay Area, it can be, you know, five to $7,000 for furniture for a two bedroom plus, depending on what the rent is maybe one month security deposit 20 $500. So that’s what 7500 to 990 $500 initial capital, probably for one unit. Okay. Yeah. But then there’s the other the other option is like, Okay, well, you, you just pitch to landlords and say, like, Listen, I can manage your property. Instead of you getting X dollars for rent, I can get you 1.3 X and the only thing you need to do is buy the furniture and put it up front. I’ll do all the management for you. You just sit back collect rent and you get more rent than you would if you were to do a long term lease. What would you recommend for like the steps for a complete beginner and then it depends on your risk tolerance. So the two things right, you could have a high Yeah, if you have a high

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higher risk tolerance and you’re more confident. I would say go with Master leasing because the advantages there is you’re keeping all the upside, right? Yeah, you’re paying the rent the landlord market rent, and you’re keeping everything that’s over and above that, yeah, if you’re a little bit more conservative, I would go with the property management because you’re you don’t have any financial capital invested. And you are going to take lessons outside but it’s almost no risk. So with the second route you’re mainly managing with like the Airbnb listing. Yeah, so you’re, you’re still it depends it there’s, it’s really how you structure it, but you can say, Hey, listen, like you take responsibility of furnishing the place and doing whatever you want. Or maybe it’s already furnished, and I’ll manage the digital layer, right. So I’ll make sure your cleaners or maybe even physical layer and in the sense of like cleaning, right, I’ll make sure the units being continuously turned on make sure that it’s being marketed on the right websites, or make sure that your occupancy rate is high for the right prices, using all the

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different software tools, etc. So you said when you started it was with someone where you were like, oh, we’ll handle like the digital layer. And will you guys furnished it too, right? Yeah. So we’re a little I guess we waited on more of the risky side. So we did a master lease. Oh, we bought we bought all the furniture, everything. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Interesting. So might be a good route to even like for newbies to just start. Have because it’s like, cheaper than buying a whole property. Exactly. Yeah, that was our idea was like, Well, like I just graduated from college. Do I really feel comfortable? Like, not that I have that much of my own money, but do I feel comfortable putting a lot of my own money and raising money from family and friends and something that like, I have no idea how it’s going to do. And not only that, like, after all expenses, I’m only expecting a couple hundred dollars a month in cash. Yeah, right. And I think as a younger person, I don’t think I’m going to speak for everyone but I think a lot of people do care about cash, right? Cash Flow is king, right? So if you can build an engine that

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Providing this cash, then you also have ultimate time value, right? You can unlock yourself from your job and use all that extra time to maybe actually go and learn all the necessary things you need to do about buying property. Yeah. What would be like the worst case scenario? If like you did this and you invested that money? Would it be like no one renting you have to pay the whole year of? Yeah, I just the absolute where if you were to take this on a spectrum, right? Like, if you were to go to like negative infinity, the worst possible case, the worst possible case would be you sign a lease, you furnish it? And you just can’t get anyone in there. Right. That’s the worst possible case. I would say one level above that. That’s way more realistic, is you sign a lease, you pay for the furniture, you can’t get any short term rental people to rent it, or you can’t get any corporate rental personally rented. So then you just find a long term tenant, and you just get market rent or maybe you ask for $100 above market because it’s a furnished rental right like the end of the day.

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Yes, because you’re so when you’re going into this with the landlord, you’re getting permission to sublease, right? That’s the whole deal. You’re making sure that you’re signing a lease that allows you to sublease, you have to be very upfront with that let the landlord know your business model and say, you know, put it in the lease thing like I get permission to sublease. So if that’s the case, if you can’t figure out a way to do short term or firm or mid term rental, corporate 30 DAY PLUS rentals, you can always get a long term lease.

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Long term someone to rent a long term. Yeah. Okay. Interesting. So when you research these neighborhoods, what are things that you look forward to make sure it will like profit on Airbnb insights like that? Yeah. So there’s the tool called air DNA. It’s essentially a data analytics tool that helps you go from a granular level of like different markets, right. So how is some of that markets we operate in like Redwood City or and you have to be very careful about ordinances. So different cities, especially in the Bay Area, have different ordinances different short term run

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laws or regulations in Redwood City, you’re only allowed to do 30 DAY PLUS, right? So it’s very important to make sure you’re compliant with these regulations. So we, in Redwood City do strictly 30 DAY PLUS, and then some markets where it’s not defined yet or it’s legal like Pacific or any other market where it’s legal, we typically try to do short term rentals where it’s more profitable. And yeah, so it really depends on on regulations and stuff. Sorry, I forgot. I was mainly researching if it will, yeah, sorry. So yeah, so there’s this tool called air DNA, you can use that to figure out what the market climate is right. So whether, you know some areas, you can literally search from the market. So let’s say you live in, I don’t know Arizona, and you want to see a Phoenix is a good market for short term rentals. So you can go and put the city and it’ll give you all information like what is the rental demand, what is the regulatory risk, what is the seasonality risk, how much revenue you should expect? What is the typical occupancy? You can break it down in terms of like, What are all these metrics for one bedroom? What are all these minutes?

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Thanks for a studio, what are all these metrics for a two bedroom, etc. So there’s a lot of data out there, you can just leverage the data and see if it works. We found that it’s more or less accurate, and it’s definitely way safer than just being like, okay, I live in, you know, Kentucky, I’m going to just open up a short term rental with no knowledge. You just invested in that tool before you like Yeah, exactly. And it’s a song. Yeah, sorry. It’s a software tool. So you can just subscribe. You just buy the subscription. And it costs I think, maybe $30 a month.

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Yeah, so you just pay $30 and you can look at it and analyze the data and understand you’ll feel a lot more comfortable that way. Yeah. I actually think I think my friends friend.

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Really? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, really? Good friends here. Yeah. You should you should pay me to

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marketing their site that’s actually going to him like a long time ago. Sure. Ya know, it’s a great it’s a great website. It’s obviously very helpful for investors. Yeah. Okay. Awesome. So when you do your Airbnb listings, you have any like tips

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How to do them and how to market your listing. Great question. Yeah. So, yes, so there’s this book called optimize your Airbnb. I forgot who the author is, but it was started by an ex Airbnb employee actually really smart guy are very clear. He communicates his information very articulately. So that book it’s called optimize your Airbnb, it goes into detail of how to make sure that your Airbnb listing is optimized to its full capability in terms of search rankings, right, because the way your property gets the most eyeballs is how does it compare to listings? When someone is looking for a property, similar property in that location, right. So if your property is more towards the top of the search, you’re going to get more demand you’re going to get be able to leverage higher prices, you’re going to have higher occupancy, etc. So that book will really help you understand what are the criteria and factors that affect that Seo?

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Do you like have certain things you need to do to become a super host? Or

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Yeah, so yeah, so the maybe I can just talk a few about a few of the factors. So Airbnb has something called Instant book or request a book. So instant book means if a guest goes on Airbnb and they find your property, they can just instantly book it just like you’re, you know, you go on a hotel website, you can just book book to the place that helps. You have to almost think about Airbnb, right? Like Put yourself in Airbnb position and think about what they want to sell to their guests, right. They want to make sure their guests have good products, right. So what goes into good product, right? The guest should be able to look at a property and be like, okay, I want to book this right now. They shouldn’t have to request a book all that right. So that’ll help your ranking. Obviously, ratings and reviews help right they want to push the listings that are actually liked by guess. Obviously price helps, right? They want to make sure that guests are getting a good deal for a bang bang for their buck because you have to keep in mind that Airbnb is competing with hotels right?

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They’re essentially trying to get all these vacation corporate travelers to move from renting in hotels, staying in hotels to stay in Airbnb. So pricing is important pictures, obviously a very important do not take pictures of yourself on your iPhone, again, a professional photographer and just making sure that your your listing has a lot of a lot of marketing material. It really stands out. Yeah, you really have to make sure that like you’re you’re paying attention to what Airbnb wants to sell to their guests. And if you think about it, logically its price. It’s all these different factors I mentioned. Awesome. What would you say? Is it like the hardest part about this business model? I think unique to this business model. It’s almost taking action. I think that’s not quite unique to the business model obviously, because at taking action is a problem for anyone. But I think it’s very important and core to this business model because the problem I found especially with me in the beginning

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is you can get stuck on this train of constant research and constant learning in constant alternative ways of procrastination, right learning is great. Don’t get me wrong. I think reading and educating yourself is great. But I think it becomes a problem when you’re getting satisfaction from learning and feeling like you’re taking action. Yeah, because you’re reading all day, every day for weeks on end. But you’re actually not taking tangible next steps. Right. So the hardest thing quite simply would be to take action to go from like, zero to one. Oh, really? Yeah. So you know, you haven’t had like too many obstacles so far. No, we have.

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Yeah, we have I think, yeah, we have had obstacle it’s raising money, for sure. Right? Because you have to be able to have enough investors who are willing to buy into this idea to help you sponsor the furniture cost. I guess we haven’t had as much as many difficult Maybe, yeah, maybe you’re right. It’s not too difficult. As long as you have the right mindset. I think

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Okay, here’s here’s what, here’s how I can define it. If you’re not a systems thinker, you’re going to have a very hard time, right? Because when you’re running, we’re essentially running hospitality company. Right? So there’s so many different moving parts, orchestrating the cleaners, making sure that unit is ready for the next guest. Figuring out what the pricing is all of that you need to basically build a strong system that allows you to step out of your business, and what the business run on its own. Yeah, that makes sense. How long did it take from you know, you’re talking about like the research and reading and stuff like how long did it take from starting that to like actually getting your first property? I think about a month

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long.

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I think the minute we thought with the minute we got this idea, was it from Jenny, is it it was from Oh, it was from this article by Paul more on bigger pockets. That spoke about this other guy j Martin, who’s now a friend of ours, saying how to generate $10,000 a month without owning any real estate.

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And without quitting your job. Okay, so I found this ridiculous. So we read this article, and we were, we were kind of just blown away. And we’re like, well, if you know if they can do it if this guy can do it, and keep in mind, J Martin has this business, he generates all this money, he travels the world. He’s not involved in any way in his business. It runs on its own, if he can do it, and travel the world and not even be involved, like, why can’t we? Yeah, well, what did you study to like, get to that point? That first property? Yeah, we just I just went online and just did a lot of research about Airbnb rental arbitrage. There’s a few YouTube channel, I don’t quite remember the names. But if you just go on Google and just search and learn as much as you can, I think the most important thing though, is to my point earlier, it’s really good to learn. And I think the best way to do this is time box yourself. So say, I’m going to take the next four weeks to learn as much as I can. And after that point, I have to take action. I have to take tangible next steps. Because if you don’t time box yourself, you’re going to get stuck in that trap of constantly learning

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Right, there’s a really good law that I try to live by it’s called Parkinson’s Law. And it states that work expands with the amount of time that is allotted. Right. So if you have an essay that you need to write, and you have one week to do it, you’re going to take one week to do it. If you have one day to do it, you’re going to take one day to do it, right. So if you can time box yourself, and then in whatever it is, it could be one week, it could be two weeks, it could be two months, but make sure that you’re holding high integrity to that time box. And you’re saying, I’m going to learn I’m going to use this time to learn but after that, I have to take action. Interesting. So yeah, I’m, I feel like I’m even more interested in doing this now. So all right, for me, if I were to do like this model, should I partner someone and should I, like read certain things? And then, you know, where should I? I don’t know. Maybe you can get some advice. Yeah, part I would partner with someone for sure if you’d already we’re both working full time jobs. We haven’t made that step yet. But if you still want to work a full time job

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I would definitely partner with someone. It’s kind of to the reasons I spoke about earlier. You want to bounce off ideas with people, you want to make sure that you have you have someone to turn to when times get tough. You have someone to turn to when you want to celebrate, right? Yeah, was the time investment? Like in the beginning? It was.

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It was a lot. Yeah. Because and that’s partly because we made it a lot, right. We were doing everything, everything ourselves. We were furnishing we, we weren’t quite cleaning the apartments ourselves. But we were furnishing we were marketing, we were responding to guest communications, we were doing everything ourselves, right. And when you do everything yourselves, you’re not valuing your time as much as you could. And regardless of what business you do, you’re going to put in a lot of hours, right? So it’s it’s funny to think like we were at a way lower growth rate than we were at the beginning. But we were spending way more time on on the actual business versus now where we, we don’t really spend any time and it’s running on its own. Yeah, and the output now is way out, but before right so it’s important thing to note that like your business can

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run without you. Yeah. And as long as you’re strategic and systematic enough, then you can definitely make it work. Interesting. And you’re saying like, with one of the challenges was getting investors. So are you definitely gonna like have other people invest it rather than putting your own money like, so we Yeah, yeah, so we reinvest I haven’t taken $1 out of the business yet. So we’re rolling over everything we make into new units. Okay, we are going to put some of our own money in, but I think the goal would be if we were to scale fast enough, you know, which could mean maybe a couple hundred units by the end of 2020. Wow. It’s one of the goals we’re trying to throw out. So we can if we if we want to scale that fast, we need to make sure that like we have enough capital that can support that. Yeah. Do you find like the markets saturated or new? Do you think it’s still available for new people to come in? That’s a good question. I think there’s still a lot of market opportunity because the way the demand and this is kind of going to go into the trends of systems

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Right, we’re seeing that a lot more Millennials are wanting to adopt this transit way of living, right? They want to be able to move to one city and say, Hey, I don’t like it anymore. I’m just going to spend two months here I want to move somewhere else. Right. And that also ties into digital nomad people being just more versatile and in the movement, job able to stay here for a month, move here for a month, there’s about a 6% I think compound annual growth rate for furnished rentals, there’s a constant increase in demand for furnished rentals. And that increase in demand is currently outweighed by the increasing supply for furnished rentals, which means that it’s a chase, but if the supply increases, then they’re going to go at the same rate, but I answer your question. Yeah, I think those are market opportunities. Yeah. So what are your future goals with everything I know you said you wanted to scale it to like 200 units by 2020. Are there other things you want to do? I know like before, you’re interested in buying hold and stuff.

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Is that something you’d still be interested in later? Yeah, that’s a really good question. A mentor of mine gave me this advice. Like the last time I spoke to him, he said, Don’t get too excited about too many different things. And try to stay focused on one thing and I think when you’re just starting out, you haven’t fully learned that right. So you’re like, Okay, like, this sounds good. Oh, buy and hold. sounds really good. of flipping sounds good. Yeah. Oh, I don’t know. Like, storage unit sound good. Mobile, home park. Sound good, right. Everything is good. Everything is truly good, right. But you have to make sure that you develop a craft in a particular niche. Yeah. So you have that domain expertise. And that skill capital, the leverage and use to actually grow in a rate that you can support. So I think to answer your question, like where I think we’re going to stick to this, right now our goal is maybe Yeah, we sounds ambitious when maybe a couple hundred units by the end of 2020. And stay in this and keep it as

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Organic as possible, try to maybe raise more debt financing than equity and own a lot of the business still and then maybe take all that money that we’re generating and then maybe venture out into like putting that money in a buy and hold. Yeah, for something like I and I, and I mean that to say like, it’s okay to do new things. But I think you shouldn’t do many things at once. Yeah, I think you should really stay focused on something for a few years a decade. And then if you want, move, and really learn something, but not multiple things at the same time, yeah, you gotta like master one. Yeah, exactly. Otherwise you’re you’re you know, you’re an inch deep and a mile wide. Yeah. Well, thanks share for like being on this episode. It’s gone. Yeah, it’s given me a lot to think about. I learned a lot from and so thank you so much. Yeah, no problem. Yeah. So where can people find you online, you can reach me. So my email is shift debt to 07 at gmail.com. And you can find me on Facebook chef de tu or shift out to that’s SHIVS my first name GTTU

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And you have a company website or we actually don’t Yeah, surprisingly Yeah, we we don’t have a company website we do but it’s not exactly we’re in the process of revamping it.

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But yeah, you can find me on on on Facebook, Instagram. I think my Instagram is GTTU My so get to my level.

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You find me there and your company’s name is is Astro. Yeah. Okay, so look out for that when the website is up. So awesome. Thanks so much. Yeah, no problem. So I hope you guys enjoyed this episode. Please make sure to rate review and subscribe. It really helps our podcast grow. And thanks again. I’ll see you guys in the next one.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai